RE: [computer-go] GTP and Tourney in SmartGo 1.4

["Daniel Burgos" <Daniel_Burgos@xxxxxxxxx>]

I agree with you. The strong point of Unix is the KISS principle (Keep
It Simple Stupid).

Have you take a look at http://www.wxwindows.org/? It is released with
L-GPL license.

Dani

-----Original Message-----
From: computer-go-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:computer-go-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Don Dailey
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 2:04 PM
To: computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [computer-go] GTP and Tourney in SmartGo 1.4


I think you identified the problem.  Windows seems to treat everything
differently (whenever possible) and Unix tries to treat everything the
same whenever possible.  This even extends right down to file systems.
In Unix  the abstractions is that all  files appear to be  on a single
file system.   In Windows a  file path has  to also state  which DRIVE
it's on and  that's annoying.  It's like one  more level of complexity
that you  have to always  account for and  program around.  Not  a big
deal by itself, but when many things are that way it's gets in the way
just like the problem we are dealing with.

- Don


   X-Original-To: computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   X-Authentication-Warning: eclipse.isltd.insignia.com: ddenholm set
sender to
	   ddenholm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx using -f
   From: dave.denholm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   From: Dave Denholm <ddenholm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
   Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 09:41:27 +0000
   User-Agent: Gnus/5.1002 (Gnus v5.10.2) Emacs/21.2 (usg-unix-v)
   Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
   X-BeenThere: computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.2
   Precedence: list
   Reply-To: computer-go <computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
   List-Id: computer-go  <computer-go.computer-go.org>
   List-Unsubscribe:
<http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go>,
	
<mailto:computer-go-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe>
   List-Archive: <http://computer-go.org/pipermail/computer-go>
   List-Post: <mailto:computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
   List-Help: <mailto:computer-go-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=help>
   List-Subscribe:
<http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go>,
	
<mailto:computer-go-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=subscribe>
   Sender: computer-go-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

   elvire.scheibling@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Elvire Scheibling) writes:

   > William Shubert has asked me to post his answer to the list:
   >
   >
   > On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 09:51:10PM -0800, David Fotland wrote:
   >
   >> You say that I might want to implement GTP to communicate with
other
   >> programs, and you say that GTP is just a protocol, and says
nothing
   >> about the communication channel that carries it.  But don't
existing
   >> programs that implement GTP use pipes?  If I implement for
example, a
   >> TCP/IP version, I don't think it will talk with Gnugo.  That's
where I
   >> got the impression about pipes.
   >
   > Most engines using GTP right now just use stdin/stdout (for C
   > programmers, that means just using "scanf()" or "getchar()" to read
GTP
   > commands, and "printf()" to write the responses back). I'm not sure
if
   > this is what you meant by "pipes" or not, stdin/stdout are usually
pipes
   > but could also be FIFOs or network sockets or whatever. In any
case,
   > this mechanism makes things incredibly easy for the engine author.
Then
   > the GTP server writer has to do the work of making sure that
   > printf/scanf gets to the server properly.
   >


   I think that's the probem : on unix, it's trivially easy for a
wrapper
   script to open pipes / create sockets / etc and bind them to
stdin/stdout,
   then exec the engine. The engine just reads/writes to these file
descriptors
   and everything works transparently.

   While windows has all these IPC mechanisms, it doesn't treat them all
   as files, as unix does, so you can't mix/match your function calls.
You
   have to know what sort of connection it is you are dealing with. You
   have to use send()/recv() for sockets, but different calls for pipes.
   (Maybe ReadFile/WriteFile works for pipes too - I don't know
details.)

   It's a long time since I've had to write on windows, but back then,
   winsock was not fully integrated, and you could not treat sockets and
   pipes the same.


   You could certainly set up a layer (people probably already have)
which
   wrap IPC endpoints in a generic framework so you can use the same
   fns to read/write on all different IPC types.


   Another approach to this problem on windows could be to define a
   DLL interface for a GTP comms module. Then engines can load one of
   several DLLs to implement GTP over various IPC types.


   dd
   -- 
   Dave Denholm              <ddenholm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
http://www.esmertec.com
   _______________________________________________
   computer-go mailing list
   computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
   http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go

_______________________________________________
computer-go mailing list
computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
_______________________________________________
computer-go mailing list
computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go