Re: [computer-go] 2nd KGS Computer Go Tournament

[Don Dailey <drd@xxxxxxx>]

One more thing to add.   

It's true that some programs haven't yet implemented the protocol and KNOW
the stones are dead but will not clean them up.   

But by scoring for the program you have to make a judgement that this
really is the case.  If you are wrong, you are rewarding the ignorant
program and in some cases actually changing the result.  So the
situation becomes MORE than just a scoring situation.

William early talked about the separation between "playing" and
"scoring."  There should not be a separation because if you score for the
program, you could be changing the result.  You can't base your
decision on the belief that a given program "should" be able to win or
even that you "know" it can, because then you would be adjudicating
based on your own personal judgement of a program's abilities and
that's biased.  

With chinese scoring, there is no good reason for trying to separate
the scoring phase from the playing phase when it's not possible in the
first place, and when it's so easy to do it right anyway.

- Don




>  Nick,
> 
>  I assure you that kgs-genmove_cleanup and "final_status_list dead" are
>  EASY to implement.   
>  
>  kgs-genmove_cleanup just means to play the game out to the bitter end.
>  
>  final_status_list dead is really simple,  it just means "give me a list of
>  all the stones you think are dead for both colors."
>  
>  Believe me,  if a program is good enough to pass before killing the opponents
>  dead stones,  it KNOWS the stones are dead and "final_status_list dead" can
>  be implemented easily.
>  
>  If the program DOESN'T know this, then it shouldn't be passing.  If it
>  passes anyway and you end the game by scoring it, you are being unfair
>  to the opponent because you very well might be aribitrarily changing
>  the result of the game.  If the program doesn't know the stones are
>  dead, the opponent may be able to save them.
>  
>  In fact, you might as well stop the game even earlier,  when YOU judge
>  the game to be decided.
>  
>  
>  - Don
>  
_______________________________________________
computer-go mailing list
computer-go@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/