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Re: [computer-go] Wishlist for playing programs on KGS

I'll agree that use of clear_board as a start of new game indicator may seem a bit of a hack, but in truth all bots treat clear_board as the start of a new game even if it is just to handle an undo (by starting a new game and replaying all the old moves). I think using that as an indicator of a new game is probably a fair enough compromise.
In truth, the suggested chat mechanism could be used in conjunction with a proper new game signal via gtp. Of course, the added benefit for that really is minimal and I'd say unneeded.

The chat with bot thing seems like an excellent way to add all sorts of flexibility and I look forward to seeing it. I just wonder if it's private message chat or chat in the actual game window. I can see uses to both. Personally I'd prefer to see in-game stuff to allow for basic analysis commands while watching a game...

Michał Bażyński wrote:

>-----Original Message-----
>From: computer-go-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >[mailto:computer-go-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of >William M. Shubert
>My solution:
> 3. When a game ends, the engine will get a clear board request.
> Since clear boards never appear in-game (as long as >you support
> the undo command that is!), an engine can treat this >command as
> a "the game is over" signal. When the engine exits, >kgsGtp logs
> out, so if an engine decides though chat or any other >mechanism
> that it should log out when the game ends, it can simply exit
> when it gets the next clear board request (or exit >right now if
> the last request that it received was a clear board).

> * Adding an extra GTP command to query the engine "should we do
> another game?" also lacks flexibility, and doesn't seem to
> simplify engine programming any over the chatting proposal.
> Really instead of this, the engine could simply exit when it
> gets a request to clear the board, that would do >about the same
> thing.

i love being able to hear user text, and being able to answer, but as far as
logging off problem is concerned this has a feeling of a dirty hack added
last minute under time pressure then a real fix. instead of adding a new
command for this purpose we try to use the fact that there's a command, used
for something else, that for some users can be used for telling the game has
ended. i do not allow undo's so for me it is not a fix at all.
additionally, the mechanism assumes i have a java computer with
windows/xwindows ready, and that i want to stop playing now, and not some
time in the future. all in all i do not see how can this be claimed to be
more flexible then a specialized command. (in fact the chatting mechanism
has nothing to do with game-end problem - i can tell my program i want to
stop playing in any number of ways, without the chatting thing. the proposed
fix to end playing problem is 'stop disallowing undos, log-off when you get
clear_board [or simply wait for time_settings, or board_size, or

so in one word chatting mechnism is cool and would be great to have, but my
feeling is that the problem of logging off is not proposed to be solved at

mike bazynski

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