Re: [computer-go] Wishlist for playing programs on KGS

["Raymond Wold" <computergolist@xxxxxxxxxx>]

On Sat, 15 Oct 2005 00:07:42 +0200, William M. Shubert <wms@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

> [using first parameter keywords instead of character symbols]

Sounds like a much better idea.

Are there game types which has a sense of "opponent" yett allows others
to talk? If so, make sure that there's a way to distinguish the opponent
from the kibitzers.

>> After each move by opponent before genmove send empty chat:
>> "kgs-chat"
>> Reason: Can teach opponent, for example if in game IdiotBot-Newbie
>> Newbie fills eye, it could say something like "Not good idea to fill
>> your eyes, if you continue that I can capture your group".
>> Sometimes really new players do proceed to fill their unconditional
>> territories until there is only 1 empty point left.
>
> Having a "teaching robot" that gives tips is exciting, but to do it well
> is probably still far beyond the abilities of today's programs...yes,
> they could probably notice when somebody fills their own eyes, but could
> they do much more?

There are several tasks computer programs are well suited for, and easy
to make for; things like listing the number of liberties for the group
played in last, whether you're playing in a ladder that works or not,
whether a move is a ladder-breaker, or even just adding "Atari!" after
relevant moves. In addition, bots that are coded with some concept of
"human" go goals could add details on why it moved as it did; my bot for
instance works with weighted modules, and I'm sure at some point it could
output things like "I made this move exclusively to save/secure my group"
"This move is meant mainly as a shape move" "This move both add liberties
to a group of mine, and threatens one of your groups" etc.

> I'll have to think about that. I'd probably use a different command if I
> do it. Maybe "kgs-comment_query" to query for a comment? It seems like
> the "kgs-chat" is primarily a way to send messages/commands/queries to
> the engine, and it contains information from the opponent, so it would
> be best not to mix that with queries to see if the engine has something
> to say itself.

A comment query has other uses as well; any bot implementing it can be
used to annotate a SGF file for instance.

>> No need to support chat at all for this to work.
>> User can just create file quit.flag which existence bot checks when it
>> gets clear_board command.
>
> H'mmm, yes. :-) This is probably the very easiest way to do the shutdown
> thing, for both the engine authors and myself.

But clear_board does not necesarilly mean game end in all cases, it can
also mean board rebuilding. Better imo to use the boardsize command, which
has been suggested on the GTP mailing list be renamed to new_game or
similar, with an implied clear_board.

-- 
W aka Raymond Wold

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